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Hi folks. Would appreciate some insight from wiser heads than mine. Any input appreciated, I'm in the dark here (moving up from the folding trailer stage) Considering two units for sale.
First is a 76 Itasca class A. 454 Chevy. The bad; Exhaust seems to be one of the big issues, it is developing leaks or "is starting to get loud" according to those who have heard it. Another hot button would be the roof, it is seeping or has just started to leak around the roof AC and towards the front edge. Gray water tanks starts to leak once it's half full. The good; Other than above the unit seems good. Good tires. Tranny reportedly rebuilt less than 10,000 mi ago. All batteries 3 years old. It's very clean, it has a good genny, microwave, working apppliances, etc, etc. The furnace may or may not, stove IS okay and frideg will do elec or gas. Guy wants about $2000. Deal or no deal?
Second is a 73 Winnebago Minnie Winnie. This one is obviously road ready and registered since the guy used it for deer opening. Has NO A/C of any kind where the Itasca does have not only A/C, but cold A/C. Body is intact, in fact both Itasca and Winnebago look good for their respective styles and ages. Owner has had Winnie for 6 years, obtained from his uncle. Dodge 318 CI. Prior to current owner getting it water pump and both heads were replaced. Front floor pan was also rusting out and was replaced. Has a handheld shower only in the toilet cubicle, but guy cannot tell me if that works, or if any of the water systems work as he never used them. Stove, fridge, and furnace DO work. This guy wants about $1500. The Itasca looks better and is more desirable at first glance, but I am undecided. Winnie seems like it MIGHT be less needy to start off and it IS closer (20 miles to the Winnie - 180 to the Itasca).
Based on what I have described, anybody care to offer any feedback or give me any ideas? I'll be looking at both over the weekend hopefully. Many thanks.
Tom
The Itasca is sounds like the better deal to me as well.
You're talking about 30+ year old iron. $2000 is about what that Itasca rig is worth in salvage, so it sounds like a fair price.
You can replace the exhaust system with top quality parts for about $500 if you do the work yourself. That's the price from the exhaust manifolds to the tail pipe, providing you don't have to replace the exhaust manifolds. The roof leak needs to be addressed immediately; Nothing does damage like water.
If the second seller seems shifty to you, it's probably best you don't deal with him.
Well Tom both rigs made by Winnebago,How many miles on each? If your are using as a flat lander you might get by with the 318 dodge but any hills its under powered. Check the date on the good looking tires more that 7 yrs. or so means new ones no matter what thay look like. Be ready to put some bucks in fixing them up into good shape.New belts, hoses,tune up etc.Nothing wrong running older rig if its in good shape and well maintained. The 454 will use a bit more gas but you will need the power on any hills or hard grades.Check with a tire shop before looking at them,they can tell you how to read the code for the date of Mfg.on the tires. Can you do any motor work if needed?Roof leak should not take much to fix. Sounds like the 318 lost the water pump and got hot and maybe cracked the heads? How are you going to use it,log road trips or short camping trips.Better have it in top shape for any long road trips.I would pull front wheels and repack front bearings,check or replace rear brake shoes can be costly if you have to have it done.May be time for brake hoses if they have not been done.On the Chev.454 front hoses sometimes close up where they are clamped and will burn up the brakes,if not changed I would change them,had mine over heat but near home so nothing damaged. Shocks may need to be replaced. Good Luck MIKE Maybe RICH will log in and give more info as it think he works in a RV service shop.
I actually don't have a helpful response, but a question. With a 1988 minnie winnie, 454 engine, 23 foot, what do you think of its towing capacity of a 3500 lb horse trailer. We would only be hauling about 2-3 hours away?
I think you will be happier with that 454 also. The 454 Chevy and the 460 Ford have been hauling alot of huge Class A's around for along time. My little 21 ft. Chinook has a 460 with 97,000+ miles on it and it still thinks it is brand new. The emission controls cause all the headachs on those big engines. If you can keep emissions in line the engines run great. I am not sure but the 1976 should not have to much of a problem with emissions. It will probobly be a good strong running engine for you. Fix that roof leak asap. Good luck my friend.
Update: Thanks SO much to all who responded. I was (and am to a certain extent still) really in the dark as to these MH issues. With your guidance and applying some common sense and already possessed vehicular knowledge I am feeling much better about the situation. Yes, I do have some mechanical ability so am able to handle some things. I wouldn't be considering a vintage anything without at least that. It's another part of why I am considering vintage; much simpler than today where everything is more confusing and has more electronics than Apollo 11 did. Where I am now is; probably about to close a deal on the Minnie. I have discarded the Itasca since I was getting very uncomfortable with that. That came from knowledge I obtained here as to what I should be looking for. I gather the roof leak was a MAJOR deal, right? The seller was very ho-hum about that, saying it had been doing that for awhile, probably would need some attention fairly soon....but he had NEGLECTED IT HIMSELF. What else has he neglected that he isn't telling me? That, coupled with the exhaust, coupled with the distance to the unit itself made me say "uh-uh". The Minnie on the other hand turned out to be a different story. I saw it yesterday and met the owner. Took the wife with me. It was cold, and snowing. He fired it up and I listened to the 35 year old mill purrrrrrr. Unbelievable. Not a tick. Not an oil spot under it (driveway parking is limited, no way he had moved it prior to my coming), nothing. He revved it. "roar!" Sweet. On to the rest of it. Wife was cold, so we went inside and he lit the furnace. Worked fine and in a few minutes she wasn't shivering anymore, in fact she was starting to look like: "hmmm. Maybe Tom HASN'T got such a boneheaded idea here after all". Lol. Seller demonstrated oven, stovetop burners, refrigerator running on gas and electric (he had the rig plugged in), and everything else we could think of and was able. Water wasn't possible since it's all drained for the winter at the moment. My initial feeling of "shiftiness" on his part evaporated upon meeting him. He's one of those guys who come across as fast talkers is all, especially on the phone. In person he is just eager to help answer questions. His father was there too and eager to answer what HE could, which was quite a bit. There was an issue with the toilet only, and I will address this later in this forum should I purchase it. Basically the pedals wouldn't move. He seemed dismayed by this and said they were frozen and he could free them up, but I told him not to bother. The tanks were empty anyhow, all of them. It HAS been averaging 20 degrees here for a couple of weeks anyhow. Anyhow, thanks again for all the feedback and look for me again in these forums if I buy it. If not the Minnie it'll be a small travel trailer taht I can pull with the wife's Jeep Liberty. Not sure I want to do that, but that's an issue for another posting. I especially like this mechanical forum and am glad to have found it.
I would like to see a few less miles on the Itasca but that is OK if it has had good service. Do you have a limited budget of around 2k? I see them out here in southern Cal. in the mid 80s for 5 to 6 k with low miles around 30 to45k miles. Its going to cost a bit to put any older rig up into top shape. Again can you get help and do brakes,belts.hoses,plugs things like that. Look for 8 mpg going down hill. If you can't do any work maybe take a auto class at you local jr. college so you know something about whats going on. Do you have some basis tools? Just a few more ideas Mike
I personally do not like the GM P-series chassis. I know bazillions of RV's, buses, and deliverly trucks were built on that chassis. But I still don't like them.
I particularly do not like any of the Class 'A' motorhomes built on that particular chassis because the empty weight of the vehicle is pretty close to the GVWR of the chassis. Remember, the P-series chassis is just a warmed over 1-ton pick-up chassis.
Not that most Class 'C' motorhomes are much better when it comes to being overweight. The thing is, I have seen a lot more Class 'A' motorhomes way over weight compared to way over weight Class 'C' motorhomes.
From a driver's standpoint, I just like the way a Dodge Class 'C' drives compared to the way in which any GM P-series drives.
I would agree that an exhaust issue could become very expensive very quickly. But then both rigs at which you are looking will most probably need some exhaust work due to lack of use even though the one isn't exhibiting any problems currently.
454's of that vintage also have had some issues with cam shafts having the lobes worn off.
The only issues I can remember small block Mopar's having was the exhasut crossover under the carb tend to gunk up causing the choke not to pull off correctly. Not usually a problem in an RV but a particular problem in commuter cars that never really ever got warmed up.
If you are only going to be going 3-5 hours away from home the fact the 318 would be working hard on any hill is really not an issue. Ease off of the throttle and make the 3 hour trip in 3 hours and 15 minutes.
If you are going to be spending time off pavement the shorter the wheelbase the easier it will be to negotiate the less improved roads. It will also be a lot easier to turn around if you get into a place you should not have gone.
Lack of A/C is not that big a deal. How much does a roof top unit cost? Hook it up to a Honda gen set and you are good to go, on the road or wherever you decide to stop. Any dash A/C unit is going to cost $$$$ to maintain and keep operating correctly.
I would be particularly wary of any RV that has had or currently has a leaky roof. By the time I figured out I had a leak in the roof of my pick-up camper one whole corner of the camper had to be replaced.
A leak in any tank would be a major concern of mine as well. Finding and repairing the leak may cost as much as what the RV is worth. Most RV tanks are built in first with all of the other stuff built around the tanks. In order to work on a tank all of the other stuff has to be taken out before you can address the problem of a leaking tank. And if it is leaking now at half full, how long is going to take before it is leaking at a quarter full or almost empty? Fixing the actual leak is not a big deal. Getting to the point at which you can do the fix is a big deal.
Lack of a real shower is also not that big a deal in an RV that is going to be used for short periods. Full timing or even extended trips across country would require a shower/bath but for a couple of nights...
As you consider which RV to purchase, factor in the cost of going to pick up the one that is further away from home. At $3.00+ per gallon fuel for your chase car, the cost of fetching the one that is further away and driving the it home is going to add considerably to the cost of that RV.
Although in my opinion the Itasca is the better deal, I think buying either one would be like opening a can of worms. First the Itasca....You could have serious damage from the leak in the roof, not knowing how long the leak has been ignored. Next is the exhaust...you could have cracked manifolds and or even broken bolts that attach the manifolds to the heads wheras you could dump $1,000 or more just into the exhaust, and so many other problems thet go along with older coaches. Now the Wuinie...totally under powered and when you step on the gas for more power, it just kicks down in passing gear and doesn't go any faster, just burns more gas. Parts for the Winnie are getting impossible to find. No A/C would be a major issue too. My best advice is to keep looking and or save some more money and step up a notch and find a little better unit. You don't want to drop all your RV money on a unit that will just sit in the yard becaust it will be too costly to fix. Good luck!
Mike, thanks for the feedback!! Means more than you can know. Sounds to me like all things being equal you lean toward the Itasca. Use will probably be shorter camping trips, 100-200 miles from home at best, but hills WOULD come into play so maybe the 454 loafing along would be better than the 318 working it's heart out (and eventually failing). The Minnie interior isn't nearly as nice as the Itasca either. Interestingly, BOTH owners claim "about 10 MPG" for gas mileage. How about the prices for each? Look about in line? Anybody else want to jump in? Feel free! :-)
Mileage looks like about 37,000 on the Minnie, approx 70,000+ on the Itasca. Itasca guy says the reading of 58,000 is NOT accurate and that he put less than 15,000 on it himself. HE seems pretty straightforward with what may or may not be wrong with the coach. The Minnie guy....not so sure. He says his uncle "replaced the heads and water pump 'purely as a precaution' when he got it since his family would be using it." Same with the floor repair and front end. "Wasn't perfect, so since he was going to be driving it all over with the family...." Something just doesn't feel right about this. Anybody else want to jump in? :-)
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